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There is a marketplace that buys aged amazon accounts. I thought it might be a good idea to sell them my amz account and make some money. The team member was quite unprofessional when he reviewed my account, and he wasn't even fluent in English (I think he was pakistani), but that was ok. Then they offered me a nice amount of money and I accepted the offer, so a team member emailed me I should send him my bank account info so he can wire the money. I told him I'm not comfortable doing that, maybe we can do some other method of payment (paypal, chase quickpay, etc.). He got all upset and was very rude to me, he said either I give him the info, or the deal is over.

So do you guys think this is a safe deal? Is this normal? I mean there are so many methods of payment nowadays, why would he insist on wiring the money, when I clearly told him I'm not comfortable with that. Is he trying to pull off some scam, or is he plain rude? I mean is there any logical reason why they would prefer wiring money over other methods of payment? I can't help but think this is some kind of scam, although the marketplace has quite a lot of good reviews (or maybe they're fake?).

Bach
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    If you think it is a scam, it does not matter whether it is a scam or not. Avoid it. Related question: what are Amazon's terms of service for transferring seller's accounts? – Eric Lippert Jan 28 '20 at 18:30
  • @EricLippert Why do you think I should avoid at all costs? – Bach Jan 28 '20 at 18:35
  • When you say "avoid at all costs" you are implying that there is some cost to avoiding it. What is that cost? – Eric Lippert Jan 28 '20 at 18:39
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    Question for you: What value is there to take someone else’s amazon account? If none, it is a scam because why would they give you money for something of no value to them? Also “avoid at all cost” is a figure of speech. It just means avoid no matter what else. – Damila Jan 28 '20 at 18:46
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    An Amazon account that's existed for a few years, had regular purchases and reviews would be useful for companies who are writing reviews for their products to boost their positions in search results. – mkennedy Jan 28 '20 at 18:52
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    Thank you. So it is dealing with people dealing with liars and hoping they don’t cross you. Revised question for the OP to ask himself: would his account be worth much more than the amount he is being offered? If not it is still a scam. Like someone offering $5000 for your $500 car. – Damila Jan 28 '20 at 18:57
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    @Damila: I know it is a figure of speech. I'm trying to get the original poster to do a more principled cost vs benefit analysis of this situation. There is zero cost to avoiding this transaction, but considerable risk of costs associated with a transaction if you have as little as, say, a 10% strong belief that the other party to the transaction are criminals attempting to exploit you. – Eric Lippert Jan 28 '20 at 19:25
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    @Damila: There are legitimate reasons to transfer Amazon seller accounts. Suppose you own a T-shirt printing business that sells shirts on Amazon and also at local craft shows. If you want to get out of the business, you could sell it to someone else; the licenses to sell on Amazon and at the craft show booth are assets of the business that can legitimately be sold. But as mkennedy points out, a seller account can also be used for fraudulent purposes. – Eric Lippert Jan 28 '20 at 19:27
  • @EricLippert I agree with you on the figure of speech. I think I lost track of who was asking about the term. I thought the OP did not understand the phrase. Sorry. – Damila Jan 28 '20 at 19:36
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    @EricLippert Well, if this company is legitimate, and he doesn't make the deal, then he has the opportunity cost of losing the potential income that he could have made from the sale. So passing up on the deal is not zero cost. That said, you have to consider the possibility that it's a scam. Which under the circumstances seems decidedly non-trivial. – Jay Jan 28 '20 at 20:31
  • @Jay: And if he does make the deal then he has the opportunity cost of not making a better deal with someone else, or not using the asset for some other profitable purpose. What mechanism do you propose to identify which opportunity costs are the relevant ones to the decision? – Eric Lippert Jan 28 '20 at 20:37
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    @EricLippert If you wanted to do a thorough analysis, you would consider all possible things he could do with this account: Selling it to this company, selling it to some other company, keeping it, closing the account, maybe other possibilities. There's an opportunity cost for every option that he doesn't pursue. Of course in real life it's usually wildly impractical to thoroughly analyze every possible action. When I'm deciding where to buy a toaster I don't consider stores 1000 miles because I take it as a good working assumption that the time and travel expenses to go that far wouldn't ... – Jay Jan 28 '20 at 20:43
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    ... be worth it. WHen I'm thinking of buying something I usually don't consider maybe 3 or 4 possible sources, because the effort to find and research more sources seems unlikely to pay off: it's unlikely that additional sources will have radically different deals than the ones I've checked out, unless I've made my selection of which to check very poorly. Etc. – Jay Jan 28 '20 at 20:45
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    Whatever happens, buying an "aged amazon account" probably points to shady practices. But for clarification, was this a seller or buyer account? How did they "review" your account? Did you give them your password? Did you already remove all payment methods and delivery addresses? How much did they offer you? – jcaron Jan 29 '20 at 11:59
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    @EricLippert That only applies to Business accounts. If you have a sole proprietorship, even if you've built a good customer base, the business is YOU. The seller rating is about YOU. Even if you sell your designs and the right to make them to someone else, that person is an unknown quantity and does not deserve your seller rating. – Harper - Reinstate Monica Jan 29 '20 at 13:43
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    @EricLippert I stand corrected. Even business accounts cannot transfer. Each human is allowed 1 Amazon seller account for life. https://sellercentral.amazon.com/forums/t/someone-just-offered-to-buy-my-amazon-seller-account-should-i/205810 – Harper - Reinstate Monica Jan 29 '20 at 13:57
  • @jcaron this is a seller account, they reviewed my account by sharing my screen with them. So far I didn't give them passwords or anything, but if I accept offer they might remove stuff and edit them as they please, which also kind of worries me. – Bach Jan 29 '20 at 14:43
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    @Harper-ReinstateMonica: Hence my question about what are the rules for transferring accounts; thanks for the clarification! – Eric Lippert Jan 29 '20 at 17:42
  • @Bach Are you serious? Did you really let them get control of your computer with Teamviewer or another similar software? You are getting scammed. Change your passwords RIGHT NOW, and ignore them from now on. – Gabriel Jan 29 '20 at 20:33
  • @GabrielC. that has nothing to do, It was just someone fixing something remotely on my pc. – Bach Jan 29 '20 at 20:57
  • @Bach If you are not just trolling us, you need a reality check. Checklist of a scammer: Indian accent, needs your bank info, wants to connect to your computer to 'fix it', gets angry when you don't comply. Want endless examples? Check out Kitboga on Youtube. He's pretty much making a living out of making scammers angry. If you proceed with talking to those people, you will be sorry for it, but hey, a fool and his money are soon parted. They are testing you, don't fall for it because you'll lose more than just an amazon account. – Gabriel Jan 29 '20 at 21:04
  • @GabrielC. can you chil? I told you the guy that connected was not the indian guy! this was a friend of mine. ok? I'm not slow! – Bach Jan 29 '20 at 21:10
  • @GabrielC. just wondering how can you know if someone connected to my pc remotely? – Bach Jan 29 '20 at 21:15
  • @Bach With no actual IT knowledge? There no realistic way. What's critical: if you leave your computer running, connected to the internet, and unattended for long periods of time, I hope you never gave them your IP address and some login info through a remote desktop app. They could install anything they want, including keyloggers to eventually learn any password you use, including for online banking. – Gabriel Jan 29 '20 at 21:26
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    Which company buys Amazon accounts? Please add a link. – d-b Jan 29 '20 at 23:44

5 Answers5

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There are two things wrong with this:

  1. Sketchiness with bank information. He could be:

    • Planning to take money out of your account.
    • Pay with reversible/fake/stolen money, then ask you to partially pay him back.
    • Pay with reversible/fake/stolen money, then do nothing (i.e., just so he can get your account for free)

  2. Sketchiness with buying an aged Amazon account. An aged Amazon account can be used in many ways:

    • To leave fake reviews.
    • To make purchases with stolen credentials with reduced Amazon fraud screening.
    • To make purchases as a means of laundering money without it being tied to other transactions.
    • To pretend to be you in order to cheat Amazon (fake refunds, etc.)

Amazon's terms state that "You agree to accept responsibility for all activities that occur under your account or password." If you give your account to another user in this fashion, Amazon could theoretically sue you. Amazon has sued larger scale buyers and sellers fake reviewers in the past. If nothing else, Amazon may try to ban you from their platform.

It's not clear whether the company is planning to do #1, #2, both, or something else. Fundamentally, this person is doing something dodgy, so I recommend against getting involved.

I'll note that paying a user to do something dodgy/criminal is a common practice with con artists, even when all they want to do is drain your bank account. Search for the phrase, "you can't cheat an honest man," for various discussions of why this is the case.

Michael come lately
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Brian
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  • Brian if he is indeed planning to pay with reversible money, would that be easier for him to do if he is wiring the money rather than sending it thru another medium? – Bach Jan 29 '20 at 01:49
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    The "bank wire only" part of this is not necessarily a scam. PayPal and many other common payment methods do not operate in Pakistan, leaving few options. When I recently bought something from Pakistan I was nervous paying with wire specifically because of how hard it is to reverse a payment compared to PayPal or debit/credit card payment. – Jim Cullen Jan 29 '20 at 05:08
  • @JimCullen so why does Brian insist that I be worried about him paying with reversible money? Based on the fact that he was rude? Because he is buying amz accounts? – Bach Jan 29 '20 at 14:40
  • Once he has your bank account info, he could ACH funds into your account using the routing and account number on a check he found in a trash can. The bank will reverse that transfer (the transaction was not authorized), but won't reverse the money you took out of your account to pay this guy (that he defrauded you is irrelevant, the withdrawal itself was done by you, an authorized user). See How do scammers retract money, while you can’t? for more realistic examples. – Brian Jan 29 '20 at 14:49
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I should send him my bank account info so he can wire the money.

To be quite honest, this is perfectly legitimate. It's how wires work. Also, you give out your bank info every time you write a check.

(Let me strongly emphasize: legitimate wire transfers do not require your bank username/password. All that's needed is the bank's routing or IBAN number and the account number on your statement.)

maybe we can do some other method of payment (paypal, chase quickpay, etc.).

You're right. It is, after all 2020, and there are a dozen legitimate ways of transferring money. Most of what you listed, though, are America-only.

Xoom allows for US$10K/day, but not to Pakistan (if that's really where they're from).

He got all upset and was very rude to me, he said either I give him the info, or the deal is over.

That's the same hard sell technique used by crooked salesmen since the dawn of selling. I wouldn't touch this.

RonJohn
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    "To be quite honest, this is perfectly legitimate. It's how wires work. Also, you give out your bank info every time you write a check." Careful - we don't know what bank info was requested; some people asking questions such as this might not understand the gravity of difference between sharing an account number vs a login and password. – Grade 'Eh' Bacon Jan 28 '20 at 20:46
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    @Grade'Eh'Bacon the sentence after that says, "They do not require your bank username/password for a legitimate wire transfer!" How much more explicit could I be that they don't require username & password? – RonJohn Jan 28 '20 at 21:05
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    The first 3 sentences starting 'this is perfectly legitimate' could be changed - in my mind, the tone of the question is naive at best, and you are emphasizing belittling the person for asking, instead of emphasizing an abundance of caution. Just my two cents. – Grade 'Eh' Bacon Jan 28 '20 at 21:17
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    @Grade'Eh'Bacon I edited it some to show that I agree with him. – RonJohn Jan 28 '20 at 21:28
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    Note that all you should give out is your bank routing number and the account number. That is something that will be required for any sort of direct deposit - your paycheck, funds from your brokerage, your income tax refund (if you get one)... – jamesqf Jan 29 '20 at 04:30
  • "Also, you give out your bank info every time you write a check." which, thanks to Donald Knuth, I haven't done since in well over 10 years. –  Jan 30 '20 at 02:55
  • @Michael I've given out my routing & account numbers almost 4,000 times and never had a case of check fraud. However, I've had credit cards replaced six times in 10 years due to fraud. – RonJohn Jan 30 '20 at 03:02
  • @RonJohn Anecdotally, I've never had a case of check fraud, however I have only given out routing and account numbers to places like the utility company or my credit card company. The only time I had to replace a credit card due to fraud was after exactly two charges had been made - one to a home inspector, and one to Skype. Granted, credit cards do seem to have much more protection against fraud, e.g. you won't find your bank account account drained with funds in limbo for an extended period of time while things try to get sorted out. –  Jan 30 '20 at 03:22
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The real goal may be to identify suckers

Con games on the Internet are getting very, very smart. There's a trick: Screening victims to exclude the savvy. They want the right ratio of greedy, naïve and crooked... and they don't want anybody else.

Microsoft Research wrote an amazing paper about how scammers deliberately mention "Nigeria" to repel the savvy: leaving only the naïve. Offering to buy aged Amazon accounts is obviously shady as all getout, and so it also selects for the crooked, and the greedy.

So the aged Amazon account may only be a bonus; the real goal would be to identify someone who can be manipulated. You might get all the usual dodgy scam stuff. Transferring too much money "Oh, could you transfer the extra back please [using a totally different and non-reversible method]? My father just went in the hospital." (and then, the payment reverses). Printing fake paper checks using the account info, and using those against other scam victims. (Multi-way scams are now a HUGE thing, where they play 2-3 victims against each other).

Or, since you have flexible morals, they may offer you an "office worker" job cashing checks. (those same checks I just mentioned, but other people's).

Or they plan fraud with your Amazon account

You are not allowed to sell your Amazon account. Ever. It contains your reputation, both publicly and internally in their risk-analysis system.

Amazon actually contains an "eBay" inside it - anyone with an Amazon account can list items on Amazon Marketplace, which are inter-mixed with regular Amazon results. ("Sold by and ships from XXX" right under the Buy Now button). Further, anyone who sells on Amazon Marketplace can place the products in the Amazon warehouses and then, those items ship with Prime. ("Sold by XXX and Fulfilled by Amazon"). There is so much mischief a fraudulent seller can get up to, using the trust Amazon has placed in you.

It's not just that it's an aged account. IT's also a US/CA/UK account. As you surmised, these people are foreigners, and Amazon has done the "Know Your Customer" diligence to ascertain that you are an American/Canadian/Brit, and as such, have a level of trust since you're well within the reach of US law enforcement if you were to commit fraud.

If you're very, very lucky, the worst they'll do is buy a bunch of their own products with your account so they can leave fake reviews - that arms race has been going on for years. (to show the extremes they'll go to, search the web for stories of people receiving unordered product. They're willing to give up a lot of cheap Cheese junk to buy some good reviews on the platform).

If you're very unlucky, they'll use it to fund terror.

Whether or not you are OK with them doing the above, the appearance will be that you are OK with it. Since you conspired to do it.

You are implicated in whatever they do

Or, don't leave your ID at a crime scene...

Both the authorities and a sufficiently motivated private party, if burned or concerned by activities with your former account, can chase you down. For instance, I would file a "John Doe" lawsuit, subpoena from Amazon the identity data of the account owner, and your name would pop up as a past owner. Discovery would have a fair chance of turning up the fact that you sold your Amazon account for money. It goes downhill from there. The argument would soon come up that you knew, or reasonably should have known, that selling an Amazon account was a breach of contract, and that the buyers would likely be up to no good. That would remove any defense of innocence, and would increase your risk of liability, even making it hard to wipe it out in bankruptcy.

Such legal action tends to be full of uncertainties and might make for a rather nerve-wracking year, possibly leading to a substantial cash payout, at the very least for your own lawyer.

While the chance is not large, the risk is certainly large. So unless you have a strategy for dealing with those risks, you might want to think twice.

Harper - Reinstate Monica
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To answer your question directly: There is no honour among the thieves, so it's possible your partner in crime is trying to scam you.

First of all - selling Amazon account is against its ToS. See: https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=201909000

Second of all - you need an account number to wire the money. Duh. (To clarify: I mean the bank number not login/password)

PayPal is worse than banks (or the same for example in EU PayPal is a bank) - if you think using PayPal will protect you in this shady deal you're making (and you know perfectly well it's shady), you're wrong.

Marcin Raczkowski
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  • Can you add references to your claims? – bznein Jan 29 '20 at 09:45
  • @bznein I've added link to the TOS, but those are not claims, those are all facts :) – Marcin Raczkowski Jan 29 '20 at 09:51
  • @MarcinRaczkowski A fact has a source. Saying something without evidence is just a claim. – T. Sar Jan 29 '20 at 12:05
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    @Grade'Eh'Bacon "Duh?" is about as dismissive as you can get. Are you going to down vote this answer? – RonJohn Jan 29 '20 at 13:56
  • "if you think using PayPal will protect you in this shady deal you're making (and you know perfectly well it's shady)". No I don't! They are a reputable marketplace who advertise all over, and they might even have permission from amazon. There is no crime here involved, I was just worried because he wanted my bank info! – Bach Jan 29 '20 at 14:37
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    @Bach "You are responsible for maintaining the confidentiality of your account and password and for restricting access to your account, and you agree to accept responsibility for all activities that occur under your account or password." Do you really want to allow someone else who you don't know access to something which is your sole responsibility? "they might even have permission from amazon" I doubt Amazon would give anyone permission to break their ToS. "There is no crime here involved" maybe not a crime, but definitely a shady deal which breaks Amazons ToS. – GrumpyCrouton Jan 29 '20 at 16:36
  • @T.Sar-ReinstateMonica I mean, Earth revolves around the Sun. I guess that's a claim not a fact? Don't play semantics, there are jsut some pretty basic things that are obivious, or require a very simple google search, so why bother providing references. – Marcin Raczkowski Jan 31 '20 at 17:44
  • @MarcinRaczkowski Skeptics.SE taught me to never go with the "that's just obvious" excuse. A lot of times, the answer is very counter-intuitive and/or surprising. When dealing with poorly-know stuff ("pay-pal is worse than banks!"), it is better to offer a reference than just say "those are facts". – T. Sar Jan 31 '20 at 17:47
  • @GrumpysaysReinstateMonica In Brazil at least, this is a crime. Amazon keeps some personal information that says that you is you. If you buy an account, you're effectively buying an identity of someone else. This falls under identity fraud. – T. Sar Jan 31 '20 at 17:50
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It's a scam from the start. Offering to buy your Amazon account is a scam. It is not legal for you to sell that Amazon account, and Amazon can and will hold you responsible for anything that goes wrong with your account. For example if these people sell stuff, take the money, but don't deliver anything, Amazon will hold you responsible for returning the money.

So we have established now that the people trying to buy your account are scammers. And since he is a scammer, you will NOT receive any money from him that you can legally keep. Anything you will receive in your bank account will disappear shortly afterwards, but since they are scammers, they may have other tricks up their sleeve.

gnasher729
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