1

What troubles me is the notion of equality and related axioms. I used to think that “x=y” means that “x and y are precisely the same thing”. But now it seems to me that the statement “x and y are the same object” is actually defined by the statement “x=y”,which seems more formal in mathematics. And the relation of equality, to a large extent, is just a matter of definition. We may define the relation of equality for a class of objects freely so long as the axioms of equality(reflexivity, symmetry, transitivity and the axiom of substitution) are all satisfied. Is that correct?

What troubles me most is the axiom of substitution, though. I know that any operation on objects defined using previous well-defined operations on those objects is also well-defined. Sometimes I succeed in understanding this (For instance, subtraction on the real numbers is well-defined, because subtraction is defined in terms of previous well-defined operations, namely addition and negation), but other times, I fail to understand this. For instance, suppose that m and m’ are integers such that m=m’, and suppose that $(x_n)_{n=m}^\infty$ is a sequence of reals with starting index m,while $(x_n)_{n=m’}^\infty$ is a sequence of reals with starting index m’.Then here are some questions: 1. if $(x_n)_{n=m}^\infty$ converges to some $L∈\mathbb{R}$, does $(x_n)_{n=m’}^\infty$ converge to $L$? 2. does the equation $sup(x_n)_{n=m}^\infty=sup(x_n)_{n=m'}^\infty$ hold? 3. if $(x_n)_{n=m}^\infty$ is a Cauchy sequence, is $(x_n)_{n=m'}^\infty$ also a Cauchy sequence? ... ...

I know that these propositions are super easy to prove, but my question is, do we actually need to prove them ?(Think about the axiom of substitution for subtraction mentioned above.Though we can prove it step by step, we don’t need to)

Is it meaningful to think of these kinds of questions? (It seems I have been trapped by these questions.) I find that in most textbooks on analysis or algebra, the authors never talk about the axiom of substitution.

I'm not a native speaker of English, and I apologize for any possible misunderstanding caused by the language barrier.

P.S. Let me add a proof here. Suppose that $(x_n)_{n=m}^\infty$ is a Cauchy sequence, then let's prove that $(x_n)_{n=m'}^\infty$ is also a Cauchy sequence. Since $(x_n)_{n=m}^\infty$ is a Cauchy sequence, we have $\forall ε>0:\exists N≥m:\forall j,k≥N:|x_j -x_k |<ε$. But we know that $m=m'$, then certainly we have $\forall ε>0:\exists N≥m':\forall j,k≥N:|x_j -x_k |<ε$, which means that $(x_n)_{n=m'}^\infty$ is Cauchy. The key to this question is the substitution property for $≤$,i.e., $(N≥m \land m=m')\to(N≥m')$.

OSCAR
  • 571
  • 1
  • 10
  • IMO you are over-complicating things... We have a sequence $(x_n)$ and we have $m=m'$; is it true that $x_m=x_{m'}$? I think yes... – Mauro ALLEGRANZA May 13 '22 at 15:11
  • Depending on the context, equality may have many different meanings. Some computer languages simultaneously adopt 'equality' operators with all sorts of meanings. For example Lisp has "=", "eq", "eql" and a few others. However, in logic the meaning of equality as is Tarski's definition of truth, is the most rigid possible: two things are equal iff they are the very same thing. – Ruy May 13 '22 at 15:35
  • But how can we tell whether two things are the very same thing? For instance, are 1/3 and 2/6 the same thing? – OSCAR May 13 '22 at 15:40
  • Assume not: $\dfrac 1 3 \ne \dfrac 2 6$; then, by axioms for equality: $1 \times 6 \ne 2 \times 3$. – Mauro ALLEGRANZA May 13 '22 at 16:48
  • 1
    I have the same concern, but I have never heard of the "Axiom of Substitution". Could you give a reference for it please? – Ross Bencina Nov 24 '22 at 22:19

0 Answers0