-5

Apparently, this varies even in the same country (I'm in country A).

Case 1. University releases recommendation letter questions right away.

  • recommendation letters are submitted at the same time as the rest of the application.

Case 2. University doesn't release recommendation letter questions right away.

  • release is only after rest of application is finished.

So how will this work? My understanding:

In case 1:

  1. I work on my statement of purpose (or equivalent).
  2. I also draft recommendation letter, solicited by letter writer.
  3. I give my draft, again solicited by letter writer, to recommendation letter writers several weeks before deadline.
  4. Then I continue to work on statement of purpose.
  5. Maybe update recommendation letter draft, solicited by letter writer.
  6. Submission: Recommendation letter writers and I submit.

In case 2:

  1. I work on my statement of purpose (or equivalent) but can't do so as much as in case 1 because I have to draft recommendation letter after it is released
  2. I am unable to draft recommendation letter, solicited by letter writer, until completion of step 1, but at least I can work on the content if not the presentation as if working on a reference letter. There's also hoping universities of case 2 have similar questions to universities of case 1.
  3. Submission: I submit statement of purpose after about half of the time as in case 1.
  4. Recommendation letter questions are released to recommendation letter writers.
  5. Recommendation letter writers give to applicants to draft.
  6. I draft in about half the time as in case 1, solicited by letter writer.
  7. Maybe update recommendation letter draft based on not knowing questions prior, solicited by letter writer.
  8. Submission: Recommendation letter writers and I submit.

Might I have missed something? Did I get anything possibly wrong?

BCLC
  • 3,157
  • 7
  • 29
  • 64

3 Answers3

4

Here is the normal process of a recommendation letter:

  1. You ask someone to write a letter for you.
  2. They write the letter and answer any questions.

The mechanics of the process can vary, as you note. But your role in managing that process is mainly about giving them as much time as possible to do the recommendation. Ask them early, and if you need to send material such as questions, do it as early as you have the information.

They might ask for additional information from you, such as factual information to include, or even what things you would like them to emphasize. But the point is that the letter is their work, which consists of their evaluation of you. That is what is normal and expected.

It does seem that, at least occasionally some professors may ask you to draft the letter for them. There are several questions about that on this site, including this one. People disagree about whether this is ok when the professor asks. If a professor asks you to do this, you will have to decide what to do.

However, under no circumstances should you draft all or part of a recommendation and send it unsolicited. This is not how things work, and it looks very bad.

  • It communicates a lack of respect for the person giving you the recommendation. Rather than let them do their job, you feel you have to put words in their mouth.
  • It looks like you are trying to game the system, and at worst someone might even consider it borderline fraudulent.

Just don't do this.

  • 1
    the normal process of a recommendation letter ... contrary to what you write, these practices do vary by country and by field. (there's a question about that someone on this SE). – virmaior Oct 27 '17 at 12:42
  • (Note that I write the above by agreeing that this is best practice). – virmaior Oct 27 '17 at 12:42
  • 1
    I can speak first hand that They write the letter and send it. is not common practice on the ground in Japan (I'm originally from the US). Instead, it's expected that you will include their letter in your application -- often where you can read it yourself (not in a sealed envelope). – virmaior Oct 27 '17 at 13:14
  • @virmaior, oh sorry. Yeah I realize that isn't universal, but I missed that. Corrected. –  Oct 27 '17 at 14:38
  • 1
    I would add some statements to this answer about recommendation letter questions. Usually I believe these are answered on top of/ outside the standard letter text. – Dawn Oct 27 '17 at 15:15
  • @Dawn good suggestion, I have updated the answer. –  Oct 27 '17 at 15:59
  • Re"They might ask for additional information from you, such as factual information to include, or even what things you would like them to emphasize." and "under no circumstances should you draft all or part of a recommendation and send it unsolicited", how do I communicate what I would like them to emphasize without contributing to the draft of the recommendation letter? Also, what constitutes contributing to the draft? For example, is it wrong to give them my application number? – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 11:50
  • (Part i) I really don't understand. Why is it disrespectful to draft? 1. I don't feel I "have" to do anything. I'm nowhere in their league in terms of their writing and communication skills. 2. Perhaps we should clarify. Maybe we don't mean the same thing by "draft". What I mean is providing them a template. For example, is it considered "drafting" if I write out the first sentence "It is my great/high honour/pleasure to recommend Jack Bauer with reservation" ? Then Case 1. the letter writer can just delete the words eg "It is my great pleasure to recommend Jack Bauer 17186555" – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 11:55
  • (Part ii) Or case 2. The letter writer can choose to go for a different opening such as "I recommend Jack Bauer 17186555". So in case 1, the letter writer saves time in having to open a template and copy + paste the opening sentence. How is that stupid/unethical/disrespectful/bad/borderline fraudulent?!?!!! It's fraudulent definitely if I forge a signature, but I'm just trying to make things easier for the letter writer. As for case 2, I still don't see how this is [insert negative adjective] here. Even if it's not a strong recommendation at least the writer doesn't have to copy my application – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 11:55
  • (Part iii) number into the letter because I already drafted the letter including the application number. I really don't see how it is disrespectful to put the application number there. – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:01
  • (Part iv) 3. I think disagree when you say it is their "job" because I'm not paying them to do it. It is generous for them to do so I want to eliminate as much of the tediousness as possible. Is it disrespectful to want to make things easier for someone who is doing something generous for you? – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:01
  • (Part v) 4. Re "They might ask for additional information from you, such as factual information to include, or even what things you would like them to emphasize." and "under no circumstances should you draft all or part of a recommendation and send it unsolicited", how do I communicate what I would like them to emphasize without contributing to the draft of the recommendation letter? For example, is there really a big disrespectful difference if I were to say "Letter writer, I request you consider the following info to be included: [accomplishment], [date], [context]" – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:04
  • (Part vi) instead of presenting a draft where a paragraphs says "At [date], Jack Bauer did [accomplishment] in [context]" ? If so what?!!?!!! I just think this makes things less tedious. I didn't realize it was disrespectful to ease burden of someone doing something generous for you. Also the letter writer can just choose to ignore the draft. Or read it but not use it. It could be fraudulent if the letter writer makes only minor edits and submits but that's the letter writer's choice. Or are you saying that by presenting [accomplishment], [date], [context] as part of a draft instead of – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:07
  • (Part vii) trying to present it in a non-drafting way, I somehow make letter wrtiting not less burdensome for the letter writer? 5. How am I gaming the system? I really don't understand. I am just trying to ease burden for letter writing. It's gaming the system if I forge a signature. I'm just drafting the thing for which someone else signs or edits than signs. I don't see this as writing for an armless person or a chief of staff/speechwriter drafting for a president. I mean it's up to the president or armless person how much edits will be made. – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:14
  • (Part viii) 6. You said unsolicited. One of my letter writers asked me to draft. So the draft I would give to the letter writer is now solicited and is ok? – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:15
  • (Part ix) 7. Am I wrong? It seems: This doesn't answer the question and is asserting a non-widely accepted opinion about recommendation letter writing which may or may not be based on a misunderstanding of what I mean by "drafting". My question is about varied procedure in the case of varying release of recommendation letter forms. – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:18
  • What is your opinion on I don't know anything about the job you're applying to and what you want to emphasize about yourself? – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:20
  • 2
    @JackBauer putting complimentary words about yourself in someone else's mouth will be perceived poorly by many people. You obviously disagree, but how others will perceive it is still relevant and important. If you are asked to draft a letter it is a different matter, however, as I mentioned in my answer. –  Nov 05 '17 at 08:15
2

I think the case here is, someone (your family member, your friend, your professor etc.) has caused an obsession about reference letter questions. I strongly suggest you get rid of this obsession.

There is no such thing as recommendation letter questions. Some universities require the referees to fill out a form. Some don't. If there are no such questions, all you have to do is go to your favorite professor, and tell them the following sentence.

Hello Professor, I will apply for graduate programme in this university and they require reference letters. Can you write me one?

If, on the other hand, the university has a specific form, you just hand in that form and say:

Hello Professor, I will apply for graduate programme in this university and they require this form to be filled by my referees. Is it OK if I put your name and you fill the form?

Other than that, you are just overreacting. If you desperately want to see the reference letter, just ask two of them and read one.

But keep in mind that academics can hint some things with specific words in the letter and you might not be able to understand even though you read it.

TL;DR: If there is a form, hand the form in. Else, just ask for a reference letter. Reference letters have absolutely nothing to do with your statement of purpose.

padawan
  • 12,245
  • 8
  • 48
  • 83
  • I would agree with this except for the last line. Ideally reference letters have SOMETHING to do with your statement of purpose. If you are saying in the statement of purpose that you want to be in field X and your letter writer is talking about your suitability for field Y, it will look bad. I would not write a letter without seeing a statement of purpose to make sure I am understanding the students' prospective path and am speaking to their suitability for it. – Dawn Oct 30 '17 at 15:48
  • I am not interested in seeing the letter. I am interested in making their lives easier. Also, my question is about recommendation letters not reference letters. – BCLC Nov 09 '17 at 08:22
  • @JackBauer reference letters and recommendation letters are basically the same thing. Also, you are spending way too much effort to making people's life easier. Giving letters of recommendation is part of their job. Noone can make this task easier. – padawan Nov 09 '17 at 13:56
  • padawan, can we change easier to less difficult? – BCLC Apr 02 '18 at 02:40
  • You're right, as a matter of fact. I'm changing it. – padawan Apr 02 '18 at 12:06
  • Cannot change it because the comment was written a long time ago. But I understand where you're coming from. – padawan Apr 02 '18 at 12:07
0

I am going to address the problem of the questions and the order of occurrences specifically, without addressing the issue of drafting one's own letter. That topic has been covered elsewhere on this site.

The questions you are referring to are not open ended questions designed to affect the text of the letter. The questions are basically a form required by HR.

Typically, the reviewer drafts the letter before looking at the questions. The questions are typically multiple choice or very short answer. They are often answered outside of the letter context (i.e. on a website form). Questions may include:

  • How do you know applicant?
  • How long have you known applicant?
  • In your opinion, is the applicant in: top .1% of students; top 1% of students; top 10% of students?

As you can see, these types of questions do not impact the letter text, because they are already included. I have not seen schools ask faculty to change their letter text to include unusual/special information. If this is asked for, it is handled through the web form.

TL;DR: Think of the letter as being separate from the "questions" or "form."

Dawn
  • 16,786
  • 1
  • 45
  • 75
  • You mean it is ok to draft responses for letter writer for questions such as those but not for questions such as 'Why do you recommend this applicant?' ? If so, how do I know which questions belong in which category, and why? If not, what do you mean please? – BCLC Oct 30 '17 at 12:10
  • The "questions" you are thinking of are just a form. They will not be open-ended questions and require nothing from the applicant. If you give a dossier to your letter writer, just make sure it includes information like list of courses you took with them and dates of those courses. This will allow them to remember how long they have known you. You will not be drafting responses for these questions. If the letter writer doesn't himself/herself remember the answer to those questions, the letter writer will email or call you to ask. – Dawn Oct 30 '17 at 15:39
  • There is no need to draft responses because responses are a couple of words per question. "Student" "3 years" ".1%" – Dawn Oct 30 '17 at 15:43
  • Dawn, can we pretend I asked the question with dossier (new word learned) instead of draft? – BCLC Nov 09 '17 at 08:21