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Related to this question, except I do not believe (and have not claimed) that I have solved an open problem, famous or otherwise.

I came up with an idea (specifically, how to pronounce numbers in bases that are a power of two) that I think is useful for the research community, for educators, and in recreational math.

I have seen it mostly ignored and poorly understood. Occasionally it has been ridiculed and called 'pure crankery', 'Doctor Seuss names', 'pure bullsh*t' without the asterisk, downvoted, and even in a some rare cases deleted on internet answers sites. But about three (out of about a hundred) maths and computer professors have said it is 'valid', 'very clever, or 'works to some extent' (all on Quora).

How do I interpret this? How to find out whether I am a crank? I am not aiming to convince others that I am not a crank because only others can judge whether I am a crank or not. I don't want to convince people that I am not a crank if I actually am one, because that would mean I would be more likely to stay deluded, if I am deluded.

How should I respond to those that refuse to discuss the idea on the ground that it is crankery? What are they thinking?

cag51
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    I removed a number of obsolete comments and moved the others to chat. Please read the post notice and this FAQ before posting another comment; we can only move comments to chat once. – Massimo Ortolano Mar 29 '21 at 17:21
  • The move to comments led to some meta discussion, which has been moved to a separate chat. Please note the FAQ above; any comments below this one should suggest improvements or request clarifications to the post. – cag51 Mar 31 '21 at 02:29
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    I removed some arguments in the comments; please note our code of conduct. I also rolled this question back to an earlier version -- the question has already gone through being closed and reopened, so let us not wildly deviate from the version that the community voted to accept. – cag51 Mar 31 '21 at 19:42

7 Answers7

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If I draw a drawing on a piece of paper and show it to some friends, that won’t make me a crank despite the fact that I have zero talent in drawing. But if I start claiming my drawing is an important work and should be published or sold or talked about, then I am a crank. The difference is in having a realistic view of the significance of what you’ve done.

Your idea is “valid” and can be reasonably described as “clever”. It is a cute idea, in the same way that I thought it was cute one day many years ago when I discovered I can count all the way to 1023 using my fingers instead of 10 if I make use of binary representations. But your idea is not an idea in math — maybe in math education or in the general area (that doesn’t have a proper name because there is little need for one) of math terminology/notation. And, like my idea at the time, it solves a problem that I don’t think is a real problem anybody has: there just aren’t enough people with a need to extensively communicate numbers in base two by reading them out loud.

What does it mean when on the Internet most academics ignore your idea, and a few say you are a crank and a few say your idea is valid?

It means your idea is technically valid but not as interesting as you think it is.

How do should I respond to those that refuse to discuss the idea on the ground that it is crankery?

You should not respond in any way but leave those people in peace. People have no obligation to discuss your idea, and if they don’t want to discuss it then it means they don’t think it is interesting enough to discuss. Find someone else who does, or find a better idea that people will be more impressed by.

Dan Romik
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    I was once told that in some cultures the fingers have an ordinal, not cardinal sense. So, if you want to signal the barman to bring you one beer, hold up your pinky. But if you hold up your index finger you get four. I told this to a group of students once and was asked by a wise--guy "How do you ask for three?". Not my proudest moment as a professor, but I did demonstrate. – Buffy Mar 27 '21 at 19:33
  • Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat. – cag51 Mar 28 '21 at 20:52
  • "when I discovered I can count all the way to 1023 using my fingers instead of 10 if I make use of binary representations... And, like my idea at the time, it solves a problem that I don’t think is a real problem anybody has" The scientists who invented computers would probably disagree. There's a reason why computers store numbers in binary format, after all. – nick012000 Mar 29 '21 at 11:03
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    This answer and Stephen McKean's answer combined would be a very good answer. +1 – justhalf Mar 29 '21 at 11:48
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    @nick012000 Using binary numbers in general does solve a real problem that people have. Using your fingers as binary digits, not so much. There is not often a reason to indicate several hundred things by holding up two hands and nothing more. –  Mar 29 '21 at 14:46
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    @nick012000 there’s a reason why humans count in base 10, after all. – Dan Romik Mar 29 '21 at 15:17
  • @justhalf thanks. Stephen McKean’s answer is already very good with no help from my answer. – Dan Romik Mar 30 '21 at 21:50
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    +1 OP solved a problem which is simply not a problem for virtually all people, and has a hard time accepting it. That's all there is to it. People don't need to care about anyones ideas. – cheersmate Mar 31 '21 at 07:19
  • @Buffy that same wise--guy would have asked what 4 was in the binary way of counting with your fingers. – Maarten Buis Mar 31 '21 at 11:17
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In my opinion, "Dr. Seuss names" and other epithets you get don't contradict statements like "it's valid" or "clever". If I understand your idea correctly, you basically propose to introduce alternative number names, such as "shi" for what I'd pronounce as "sixty-four", which provides some potential benefits.

Academics would ignore this proposal because it's simply outside the domain of academic research. For me, introducing "shi" as an alternative for "sixty-four" is like proposing Dvorak (or other alternative) keyboard layout instead of the usual QWERTY.

You can do it, and you can argue why it is superior in your opinion, but what kind of response do you expect? Some people would like your idea, others would not. I personally can't force myself to use "kibibytes" and "mebibytes" even though they are kind of established.

Even if you manage to prove that your method is "better" according to some well-defined criterion, I think it is still mostly a political and cultural matter, and should be treated as such, rather than a part of an academic discourse.

rg_software
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    +1 but what on earth is a kibibyte?! – astronat supports the strike Mar 27 '21 at 14:54
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    1.How does 'pure bullsh*t' not contradict 'it's valid', 'it's very clever', and 'it works to some extent'? 2.There is pedagogical research, and psychological research. There's also linguistics, history of counting systems, and that's off the top of my head.3.How is it a political matter? 4.How is it a cultural matter?5.Your one valid point in my opinion: it is like proposing Dvorak etc. Was that ridiculed, sworn at, called crankery, and deleted and did anyone refuse to discuss it on the ground that it was crankery. If not then what is your point here precisely? – Matthew Christopher Bartsh Mar 27 '21 at 16:03
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    This box is too small, sorry. "Pedagogical & psychological research" is too general to talk about. If you write a scientific paper, it will be reviewed, and you'll receive more specific feedback rather than "bullsh*t". It's political/cultural matter because I am not switching to Dvorak regardless of it's benefits, and I can both recognize it's efficient and call enforcing it 'crankery' due to other (non-scienific) reasons I might have. Likewise, I might recognize ingenuity of your system and oppose its adoption for this or that reason. – rg_software Mar 27 '21 at 17:07
  • @rg_software 1."Pedagogical & psychological research" is too general to talk about." What do you mean? They are relevant parts of academia. 2. Writing a scientific paper isn't enough, surely? It must be published by a recognized journal surely? Otherwise it will likely not even get read let alone be reviewed. 3. Who said anything about enforcement? On the contrary. I have always maintained that there will always be a place for the current predominant method of zip code style pronunciation, just as there is in base ten, for zip codes, and other codes, and telephone numbers and so on. – Matthew Christopher Bartsh Mar 27 '21 at 17:25
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    When we discuss 'research', we usually don't discuss 'research in general', we analyze a specific work (paper). Your proposal is not 'research' because it doesn't provide experimental evidence proving anything. It isn't bad, it just isn't research (in terms of genre). It is enough to submit your paper in order to get feedback, even if it is rejected. If you say that you aren't pushing eforcement, then what is your goal? You published your proposal, and anyone interested can follow it. Some criticize it, but you can't please everybody, really. – rg_software Mar 27 '21 at 17:31
  • Who mentioned 'research'? 2. Mathematical research doesn't provide experimental evidence proving anything, does it? 3.Your only not necessarily invalid point, in my opinion: 'It is enough to submit your paper in order to get feedback'. How would I go about submitting my idea as a paper? 4. My goal is to show people what is in some situations a better way of pronouncing binary numbers, and numbers in some other bases, and hopefully get some appreciation in return, or at least see it thoroughly analyzed. 5. I never aimed to please everybody, but 3 percent seems a bit low. And why deletion?
  • – Matthew Christopher Bartsh Mar 27 '21 at 20:12
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    Right, in math you don't usually experiment, but then you solve some problem and provide proofs. And here are no problems/solutions/proofs here. (For starters, the issue you are tackling might not be considered a 'scientific problem') You can submit your idea, but the odds are it will be considered out of scope for most journals since it is not 'research', and they do publish 'research'. I can only speculate why people tend to comment harshly on your proposal, but I think no 'scientific' issues are involved here (and hence I called it 'political/cultural'). – rg_software Mar 28 '21 at 03:05
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    @astronat: See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byte#Multiple-byte_units – Daniel R. Collins Mar 28 '21 at 04:24